Curse

DivineEnvoy · Feb 29, 2008, 05:03 AM // 05:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerpall

Please pay closer attention:
Yes, supply and demand determines prices of most items.
When anet makes the Supply more readily available, that lowers the demand. Anyone who knows about selling and buying, is that a HUGE population of GW market "Demand" items in "Low Supply".

High supply = low demand
Low supply = High demand
(in most cases, but there are some skins that people just plain out don't like, regardless of rareness).

So, by Anet increasing the supply drastically (through GW:en for runics / legendary's / elite factions skins / etc), And Z-chest for Crystallines.
The Demand (and Value) Drastically decreases.

Anet decides what item's drop where. Anet did make GW right?
We players do not make crystallines drop from chests, and ex-HoH rares drop in PvE, ANET does. You can say I am blaming anet too much, but as you said Supply and demand are a huge factor. Anet being the ones in control of supply, and the community in control of demand.

Anet can implement multiple areas to drop certain items; even so, it's based on choices players make to farm these areas. Hence, without the players, no matter how many areas Anet decide to implement these items to drop in, there will be no supply of the corresponding items.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerpall

You can say "taknig game to seriously" , or even question the relevence of my points. But this is a Thread on Economy of GW is it not? Unless any of you have bought , sold, owned rarer items (Not armour) that fluctuate in prices, you have no idea what i am talking about.

Unless you've ever owned a crystalline, runic blade, legendary sword, Or even canthan rares such as Platinum items, and such,
You simply would not understand the devestating effect on the economy the drops of GW:en had.

I have a Storm bow requirement 12 marksmenship, 15% more damage while under enchanment; I bought it for 100k and an ecto back in 2004. I have all the Destroyer weapons, which I bought when the onyx were 4.1k while diamonds were 1.1k. And now people are probably going to merchant a bow like that, while onyx only goes for 3.3k. I'm still going to have a shiny bow on my Ranger, while the Destroyer set to unlock something in Guild Wars 2 for my Mesmer. There's nothing devastating about that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerpall

You can drag this back to Ego, epeen, etc. HOWEVER , this is a thread on Economy, not the Psychology

Just because we use many mechanics of Psychology to describe some of your morals to how an economy should work, it doesn't mean that what we are saying is totally unrelated to the given topic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerpall

"epeen" player (or whatever the h*ll you feel you must call people richer than you

First of all, how are you so sure that you are richer than me?

Second of all, I don't claim I ever said that I would demote someone of taking the game too seriously just because this person is wealthy in the game.

kerpall · Feb 29, 2008, 05:25 AM // 05:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by DivineEnvoy

Anet can implement multiple areas to drop certain items; even so, it's based on choices players make to farm these areas. Hence, without the players, no matter how many areas Anet decide to implement these items to drop in, there will be no supply of the corresponding items.

I have a Storm bow requirement 12 marksmenship, 15% more damage while under enchanment; I bought it for 100k and an ecto back in 2004. I have all the Destroyer weapons, which I bought when the onyx were 4.1k while diamonds were 1.1k. And now people are probably going to merchant a bow like that, while onyx only goes for 3.3k. I'm still going to have a shiny bow on my Ranger, while the Destroyer set to unlock something in Guild Wars 2 for my Mesmer. There's nothing devastating about that.

1) Regardless of how many "areas" of GW:en drop these items, ALL of these areas are in the campaign. People do not eve have to stray from the story line to get these kinds of drops, you can follow all your Primary quests and get these.

Yes, people choose where to farm
But, people buy games to play through their story-line. All of these items drop in areas that you Must go through, to complete the story line. Regardless of whether or not they choose to Farm there, the items can still drop while making their way through expansion.

2) The bow, yeah bad investment, but there are worst scenarios. (choose and pick from any of the swords i listed off. BTW i forgot about the Stygian reaver too, it probably suffered one of the highest loss of about 1200k - 1500k)

As for Destroyer weapons, i agree its not a total loss, because of the GW2 benefit, that is why i left it off of my list of "high ends that lost huge value". Because , even if you paid more, you are still gaining a benefit in GW2, where how much money you got in GW1 won't matter anyways.

Added:

Quote:

Originally Posted by DivineEnvoy

First of all, how are you so sure that you are richer than me?

Second of all, I don't claim I ever said that I would demote someone of taking the game too seriously just because this person is wealthy in the game.

This wasnt directed at you, there have however been a few posts (from whom i will not mention) that have been apparently deleted due to harassing me over "Epeen" and "Eviagra", etc. And accusing me of supporting higher prices just because ifelt economy was too low. This may or may not be your view, but that comment was directed to a couple other people.

Mio Glesin · Mar 07, 2008, 05:51 PM // 17:51

Ive played both RS & GW... I actually quit RS because of their economy update & the unbalanced tradeing system. Where people in groups were not allowed to split drops that were sold. Only this past week did RS change that.

As for the economy being better or worse.. there is no comparison as the games are totally different base economy systems. If GW economy was like RS is now, you could only sell stuff for the price that is listed when you identify things.

As it is now, party members each get fairly equal drops from chest & monsters during missions and runs, where in RS only one person was able to get the 1 drop weather it rare or not even if you were grouped.

My opinion having played both - RS set up a bad economy system to begin with and then is going through radical changes to "try" to fix it.

GW seems to have valued to each player equaled out reasonably.

Going back to RS now after getting into GW would be like choosing pb&j over steak.

andrew21594 · Mar 24, 2008, 12:40 PM // 12:40

So if all these problems are sorted for GW2, i think it could become the one with the best economy.

RhanoctJocosa · Mar 24, 2008, 01:01 PM // 13:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

Runescape in no way, ever, can possibly require skill.

Yes it does.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

The 'economy' is based on pressing buttons over and over.

However, there are actual items with worth, whereas a huge amount of the valuable drops in GW are now worth very little.

True, but I'd definitely say it's better than the GW economy.

Jagex > ANet

sir hepe · Mar 24, 2008, 05:15 PM // 17:15

Hello everyone.

I have spent quite much time reading through all the replies now.

I think the economy of Guild Wars has seen better days. Back in 2005, I really liked that not even perfect weapons costed like 80k. That gave me real purposes for the game, to get the money for a good sword. It's not bad though that now you can buy a perfect sword for err, less than 15k if its gold. But still i prefer to the more expensive items.

About runescape: short said, the economy blows. I played rs for several years, and it just keeps getting worse, a bit like GW's economy.

Sir Hepe

Introverted Dimensions · Mar 25, 2008, 03:35 AM // 03:35

Please don't compare the two games LOL.

the kurzick eater · Mar 25, 2008, 09:54 PM // 21:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by garethporlest18

Because Runescape requires more skill of course.

l....oll
please tell me this was a joke

Quote:

Originally Posted by trx despair

Please don't compare the two games LOL.

enough said.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RhanoctJocosa

Jagex > ANet

every time i see one your posts it makes me want to slap you.

Skyy High · Mar 25, 2008, 10:17 PM // 22:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by RhanoctJocosa

Yes it does.

True, but I'd definitely say it's better than the GW economy.

Jagex > ANet

How can anyone argue with such compelling logic?

the kurzick eater · Mar 27, 2008, 04:05 AM // 04:05

honestly what does it really matter... people have forgotten that this is a GAME!!! games you play for FUN! not to be the most rich, amazing person you've ever seen...

to each his own, but personally, i could care less what the cost of an ecto costs.

McMullen · Mar 27, 2008, 09:47 AM // 09:47

Initially, i thought it was a load of opinionated bull that RS had a better economy... but having had a look for the first time in about a year the game economy there has had a brutal kick up the arse.
I'd say their economy is more active (due to all prices being regulated by some grand exchange and constantly changing) but it'd be ignorant of me to say that one or the other is better.

From what I can tell, the only problem with the GW economy that it's hard to sell perfect weapons because the game is saturated with them. But that also means that there's more variety for buyers and it's easier than ever to get whatever weapon would look best on your character (with a few exceptions of course). 100k will get you prestige armour (exlcluding FoW) and a decent looking weapon with no problems.

ischuros · Mar 27, 2008, 01:30 PM // 13:30

I've been playing for 31 months now, and feel that I have played the game suitably long enough to comment on it's economy.

Like every other game, Guild Wars runs on a creation and destruction economy. That is, once you kill a mob, and it drops an item or gold, that item (I'll refer to gold as an item) is created, it wasn't there before hand. When you trade an item, money is transfered for one player to the other. So, nothing is created or destroyed. When you sell something to the merchant, that item is stored and money is created.

It is possible to create and infinite amount of money in this kind of market then. When that is possible, or happening (as it is with Gold farmers) the market is obviously going to change from the normal one we know. Now not everyone farms, so that is going to change the outcoming market aswell. You have wealth creation, but no destruction, just transfer. Therefore, alot of money is going to build up in the system. The people with it will be willing to pay higher amounts of money for items, and the traders will increasingly not accept amounts less that what the highend people are willing to pay for it. This creates a scenario where there are going to be a high amount of sellers in relation to the amount of buyers. We'll have a buyers market.

This is where it gets economic...

The Demand curves for the sellers will be off, i.e they won't be selling at where their Marginal Cost equals their Marginal Revenue. In this case their cost is their time invested, and we only think of the revenue as money since it's a whole lot easier to quantify than happiness. To rectify the situation, if you have ever studied economics you know you want to produce at MR=MC. Now since we have a perfectly competitive market here, sellers and produce are identical, when MR=/=MC sellers are either making a loss or profit. An PC market dosn't tolerate either and demand, or Average revenue curves, will fluctuate to where sellers are only making Normal Profit. As we have seen there are too many sellers in the market, selling at too high a price, so the amount of sellers will drop off, since they will be losing money and cannot sustain that, and the price will drop, since the remaining buyers will want to 'corner' the market, and get a leg up. A Price Drop in one firm will result in a price drop in all the other firms, and eventually the market will even out.

What I'm trying to say, with a lot of jargon really (got to remember the e-peen) is that people will pay what there willing to pay and sellers will sell at a price they are willing to sell at. The trade must be mutually beneficial for both to take part in it. So, eventually you'll find someone willing to sell at your price, and value is only what a buyer is willing to pay for an item.

Both economies work for their player base and, thus, ergo, vis a vis, none is better than the other.

blurmedia · Mar 27, 2008, 01:52 PM // 13:52

Runescape has some kind of auction house.

Nemo the Capitalist · Mar 27, 2008, 02:20 PM // 14:20

if u want fow buy gold

heres 50 bucks

/joke

irundroks · Mar 27, 2008, 07:12 PM // 19:12

i wouldn't say the economy is bad. It's not hard to make money; you just need to find what you're good at. i would say the variety of items is the cause of the prices, unlike RS, which is limited to certain weps.